Everything as Fuck Jun 4, 2014 at 4:00 pm

#NotAllSharks

Comments

1
Slow. GD. Clap.
2
Thank you brother. Thank you for stating this so succinctly. I've tried so often to explain this to male friends. It's so hard to get around other fella's defensiveness sometimes.
3
This is awesome. Simply awesome. Bravo Ian. You make an excellent and important argument, all the while making me literally laugh out loud. You sir, are brilliant.
4
I think I love you
5
Ian - thank you, perfect.

We've been seeing a major communications breakdown lately. Not all #NotAllMen are assholes trying to quiet the conversation. Many are. But some are well-meaning guys that are expressing themselves poorly. It isn't all a bad thing - if you read story after story of the horrible things that women endure on a daily basis, it is a natural, perfectly healthy reaction to feel guilty, even if you aren't. That's empathy.

But the problem lies in how we handle it. Seeing dozens of tweets and stories feels like a call to action. In a way, it is. We feel powerless in doing and saying nothing, so feel the need to chime in. Even if what you're TRYING to say in #NotAllMen is "There are good guys out there too and we're on your side", the way it comes across is "Yeah, I feel ya', can we talk about something else now?".

Like Ian says - the purpose of #YesAllWomen isn't to make Seth bear the sins of all men. It's to make Seth conscious enough that when he's at a party and sees his buddy James sneak off with a drunk woman, to make Seth realize he needs to step in and say "not tonight, man". It's to make Seth self-aware when he goes on a bad date and starts complaining about how all women act a certain way or want a certain thing, even if Trisha was disinterested and didn't even offer to split the check. It's to make Seth tell his buddy Dan to shut the fuck up when Dan starts complaining that he lost out on a job just because he was up against a woman. And it's to make Seth understand that when a woman is telling him she was sexually abused, she isn't asking Seth about what a great guy he is. And if those times never come? Great Seth, you've done your job by listening.

But here's part of the conversation that I think is missing (and that Ian does wonderfully here) - Seth saying something dumb doesn't necessarily make him an MRA, a misogynist, or a rape apologist, and he doesn't deserve to be lumped in with those assholes. He might have just missed the point in a moment of selfishness. If someone seems genuinely willing to understand and made a misstep, talk to them again. We all have our moments of stupidity, I know I'm no better. Sorry for hijacking.
6
let's all stop kissing fatboy's ass a second.

Is domestic violence, or even violence against women some great undiscovered continent? Is O.J. Simpson back in his white bronco driving 35 mph on I-10 again? Where's this come from Ian? You just feeling heroic today? Did you do something bad and had an epiphany? Or just screaming inanely at the misogynistic evil you see all around you (i assume back in beaverton since you had to stop writing this column when you "left"?)

Not trying to pick on you big boy. There is just no context here i can see. Most editorials start out with an anecdote or two to get you started on why a point is trying to be made. This just seems like pointless moral flexing. As if you went to the gym two times in a row and made a bicep and now you are trying it out in the mirror.

Generally i think your gift to the world is not being important. Maybe its being fat and stupid and silly and yes sometimes pretty goddamned funny. Stay in your wheelhouse my man.
7
^^ DICK
8
I was wondering where all the trolls were. Slow clap
9
Oh of course. All us bad evil men type folks have to be aware about what we say and how it affects women. But the reverse isn't true of course. And of course let a man say,"all women are ______, and you will have people up in arms.
10
Noctra - you completely missed the point. #YesAllWomen is about women talking about the hardships they endure because of their gender. That DOES NOT mean that all men are guilty of creating those hardships. But you're taking that upon yourself anyway to make it about you. This is the conversation you are trying to have:

Woman: I was raped. It was awful and I felt powerless then and feel powerless now.
Noctra: Why are you talking about this? I'm not a rapist!

You're not the rapist she was talking about, but rather than empathizing you turn it into a competition. That's a bad response.
11
Until now I only viewed your column as boring filler. You have totally justified your column in my eyes. Good job and thank you. #notallsharks
12
Ah, but when you get into "one of those" conversations that begins with "All men are pigs" how are you supposed to respond to that? The standard issue reflexive "Just the guys you date, apparently" doesn't seem to further the conversation, regardless of it's spot-on accuracy.
13
imrightyourewrong has a fair point. Some context is missing from the column for those of us who aren't already aware of the kneejerk "Not all men" response that Ian is talking about and the current campaign against it.

If you're only speaking to people who already know this, you're only preaching to the choir.
14
I feel your pain, Ian. Sometimes I think about getting gender reassignment surgery to neutralize myself as both a potentially real and perceived threat. Except my feminist instinct tells me my inverted penis would still have a negative influence on my reptilian brain circuitry.
15
Disastronaut - the hashtag isn't #AllMen, it's #YesAllWomen, you're confusing two very different statements. As are most of the people that want to point out #NotAllMen. The problem here is that when women relate their experiences of oppression and misogyny and violence. When we dare to challenge and discuss things like routinely being cat called on the street, not feeling safe walking alone, rape, domestic violence, unfair and discriminatory hiring practices, being paid less than our male counterparts, being told how to dress and what to do with our bodies, our very real experiences are being taken away from us and belittled by three words: Not All Men.

Rather than acknowledging the very real violence and systematic oppression that women face, rather than helping to challenge the status quo, rather than furthering the conversation in constructive ways men, often very good men, have found an easy out - three words: Not All Men.

When someone says, or posts: Not All Men, this is what women hear: "It's not me, so it's not my problem." or "It's not me, so I don't have to do anything." or "It's not me, I'm a good guy." But discrimination and gender violence is everyone's problem. By throwing up the Not All Men defense you've just said it's not my problem, and by saying it's not your problem, you've become part of the problem.
16
I will try to be less fat in my future columns.
17
A. Thank you for writing this.

B. I get that you have to make women's issues about men if you want them to try giving a fuck, but you might want to really think about what it means to tell men that this is about "your mother or your sister or your girlfriend or your wife or your daughter or your best friend". I get that it makes it relatable, but it's also telling of the fact that men only care about women that they feel they own in some way. Is it not enough that I'm a human and don't deserve to be harassed, raped or murdered? Do I have to be the girlfriend/wife/mother/sister of a man for it to matter? I know that's not what you're trying to imply, but since you're actually thinking about these things (let me just reiterate point A -- thank you) you might want to add that to the list of things to think about.
18
I disagree with your assertion that I have to feel some kind of ownership over a woman to have a relationship with her.

In an age when people shrug off stories about mass killings and suicide bombings because they happen on the other side of the world, yes, I think it's important to make the political something personal.
19
hey i'mrightyourwrong....it's i'mrightyou'rewrong you dumbfuck.
20
I wasn't saying you feel that way, just that the phrases "YOUR mother, YOUR daughter, YOUR sister, etc" do contain that implication, and a lot of men (the type of men who most desperately need your message) really cannot give a fuck about women unless it's in those terms.

I'm REALLY not trying to insult you, but you're doing the exact thing that your blog is talking about -- being too defensive to listen to what a woman is trying to tell you about being a woman. I brought this point up because it is a part of the larger feminist conversation that you're now participating in. I didn't make it up to annoy you (or at all). I only hope that if you read about this concept from somebody who is not writing it in response to your blog, you will not take it personally and maybe understand what I'm actually saying.

http://feministing.com/2013/01/23/gender-a…

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