News Mar 25, 2010 at 4:00 am

Police Shooting in Hoyt Arboretum Sparks Anger, Questions


The cop was probably just doing what he was trained to do. Blame the training not the trainee.
"The crowd blocked East Burnside, smashed an ATM and the windows of a Starbucks and insurance company, but otherwise caused no major damage."

The Genius of The Crowd at work
One other thing, if someone was coming at me all bloody with a knife, I'd've shot 'im too. All this ruckus is all over some nutso who wasn't taking his meds. If it wasn't the cops doing him in, it was himself.
Glad you're here to unquestioningly support the police TageSavage, because no one else would step up to the plate.

Hey, idea for you, why not go smoke some more pot and play some more X-Box and forget that shitty people often seek out positions of power and do shitty things with them. Hey! I think scooby-doo is on! if you move quick you might be able to fill that bong up and get baked in time for the first commercial.
In the 60s, there were volunteer crisis lines and crash crews to call to handle freakouts and nut cases....usually by distracting them with something as simple as a burger. We NEVER called the police.
Sounds like it's time for a return to the 60s, when volunteers manned crisis lines and crash crews, ready to handle freakouts and nutcases....we NEVER called the police.
Anyone that thinks a human life is better a life of another species should be shot.
End of discussion.
Yeah man, let's like totally go back to the sixties man! Berkley forever! Acid! Look hippie get back in your wayback time machine and hit the bricks. I'm sure none of these "volunteers" were ever injured or not qualified to deal with the mentally ill or violent. This was a man with profound mental issues (sadly) not some "dude on a bad trip, man". He was threatening the officer with a lethal weapon. I would rather the officer had responded with a non-lethal or less than lethal weapon, but I don't have a major problem with the officer using his weapon-i DO have a problem with the guy bleeding to death which suggests none of the wounds were instantly fatal. Why was more not done to save him? Incidentally how many of you clowns have ANY real life experience in the law enforcement field or the military for that matter? Damn few most likely and yet you feel the need to second guess everything. Look, the Portland Police has a BAD track record when it comes to shooting fatalities and tactics-lets improve that not bring up the groovy sixties or riot (idiots), because that really helps-not wait it actually hinders, morons. The Officers need better training, better judgement and more non-lethal options. Incidentally all violent or potentially violent and explosive encounters are unique, there really is'nt a template. If you have any experience you know that. If you don't, well..........
"The crowd marched to the police's former Southeast Precinct building shouting, 'I am Aaron Campbell! I am James Chasse!' The crowd blocked East Burnside, smashed an ATM and the windows of a Starbucks and insurance company..."

Brilliant. Was it Starbucks or the bank or the insurance company that shot the crazy guy? Oh wait, no, it was a police officer.... And they marched to the building where the SE Precinct USED to be? Wow... Anarchists will do anything for the sake of being dicks.
@ The Showstopper -

Jackie was shot in the femoral artery. Don't ask me how I know this next tidbit of information: You don't want to know and I'd rather not say in an Internet forum.

It takes just about two minutes to die from a femoral artery severance (probably shorter if you were in shitty condition to begin with, such as a transient). It's one of the most efficient and reliable ways to kill someone, right next to shooting them in the head and/or slicing their throat.

The problem is that the artery is in your leg and the blood is traveling downward. The blood comes out like a sieve and even when a tourniquet is applied, it's not 100% effective.

My guess is that Officer Walters wasn't trying to shoot him in the femoral artery. That would be an incredible feat to accomplish even at point blank range. He was more than likely trying to stop him from advancing further. Unless Officer Walters had known he had shot Jackie in the femoral artery (I'd be surprised if he even knew what/where it was), Jackie was doomed the moment the bullet severed it.
"Brilliant. Was it Starbucks or the bank or the insurance company that shot the crazy guy? Oh wait, no, it was a police officer.... And they marched to the building where the SE Precinct USED to be? Wow... Anarchists will do anything for the sake of being dicks."

So by YOUR standards it's perfectly acceptable for cops to blow away citizens at will & noone should question that. But if a group of citizens collectively express their outrage & distress at police murders, PEACEFULLY, THEY'RE the ones being dicks. Wow.
Been to any teabag rallies, lately, hmm?
Americans are so complacent - if this or the Campbell killings had happened in Europe there would have been full-on riots as a result.

The government should fear it's people not the other way around.
So if the homeless guy "accidentally" killed someone cause he thought they were Hitler or some other crazy shit that would be ok unless it was your child, your friend, your mother, brother or sister. For being such a concerned society why is it that no one considers the fear he caused those 18 people, perhaps subtracting years from their lives. I can guarantee this is not an isolated incident for this guy. Apparently he tried to turn himself in for a sex crime a few days earlier. If it is true does his remorse excuse it? He definitely had a pattern of terrorizing other people. Not just the garden variety god is coming, I am Napoleon crap, but I'm going to kill you stuff. Kinda like the murder that happened about 3 weeks ago at I think 8th and Burnside. I am with the police on this one and I am glad for the protection.
Avamac, we need to apoint a panel whose purpose is to enlighten the rest of us, esp. the police department, about what we would have done in the sixties.

Because what's happening right now is just plain medieval.
Just want to point out that a 6-inch handle and a 1-inch blade isn't going to do a whole helluva lot of damage, when you're a cop that's presumably more adept at dodging than a drunk old man. If you're not more agile than he is... maybe you shouldn't be a cop. Do they not teach hand-to-hand in the PPB?
"I can guarantee this is not an isolated incident for this guy."
You can't "guarantee" shit -- you're just guessing.

"So if the homeless guy "accidentally" killed someone"
A big "if". Again, all you're doing is vague hand-waving and trying to appeal to emotion (badly). He was homeless, most likely mentally ill, and most importantly NONVIOLENT (read the article again).

Reading between the lines of your comment, it seems that you're saying this man's life was somehow "worth" less simply because he fell through the cracks of society.
"Police Shooting in Hoyt Arboretum Sparks Anger, Questions."

I am a resident of the city of Portland and I am not angry. Nor do I have any questions.

Message to cops: Keep up the good work!

DamosA- Questioning the authority is perfectly reasonable, however- the very fact that they destroyed property shows this was not a peaceful protest. Marching at night, trying to hide themselves? Come on. This isn't a protest, it's an excuse to act out. Marching to the FORMER precinct? That's like going back to your old high school to yell at the bully that used to pick on you... who doesn't go there anymore.

Call a spade a spade-these aren't protestors, they're bratty little morons who couldn't find their bum even if a crazy guy covered in blood was stabbing it with his razor knife.
@Proslepsis, what a fascinating intelligent remark. Thank you for sharing.

The man advanced on an officer with a weapon in his hand, period. He refused to comply with a police order to drop his weapon.

Someone comes at you with a knife, you have a gun. Its your life or theirs, what do you do? Luckily, very few of us will ever have to answer that question. Why are police officers any different? They, like you, have a right to protect themselves and they have the added weight of having to protect you.

For those of you who distrust and detest the police, you're ungrateful. I hope you never have to rely on them to save your life or the life of someone close to you, because how awful and beautifully ironic would that be?
@Revolution, yes they do. Part of training at the police academy includes, sometimes up to 5 hour classes on a regular basis. That DOES NOT include engaging a man with a knife which is just idiotic and requires a death wish.

@funemployment, they didn't respond the first time because he was reportedly non violent to begin with. They did arrive after someone else called where the man had become more physically threatening.

@r.james, thank you, well said.
@Theshowstopper, you are just as uninformed. Don't sit here and boast about who has or does not have first hand knowledge of military or police training (which by the way STARTS at 16 weeks of training including, hand to hand combat, ethics, and much more. Which is all available to the public,…). You can pick any of the classes there, these are current or recent graduates of academy.

As for, "I would rather the officer had responded with a non-lethal or less than lethal weapon" that would include his baton, taser, and pepper spray which would all require close quarter combat putting himself within length of this mans weapon. And depending on his pepper spray that could carry on the wind and hit a citizen-yes it is possible, certain types of containers for pepper spray carry.

Also, new information has come out,…

"PORTLAND -- The man who was shot and killed by a Portland police officer on March 22 had sought mental help from the bureau only 11 days earlier, according to a police report obtained by KGW.

The report, dated March 11, said that Jack Collins told the officer he had molested a girl decades earlier, when he was in high school. Collins then asked the officer if "he could get mental health care."

The officer noted in the police report that he did not believe the crime actually occurred. but he directed Collins to Cascadia Mental Health for help."

I am writing this to all of my fellow community members as someone who was part of the protests against police violence the last few days, and as a member of the Black Bloc on Monday night. I can not speak for all who marched throughout the past few days, we were all there for our own reasons. United by the idea that the police violence in our neighborhoods must stop. We are not a bunch of violent, angry children set out to destroy downtown Portland. Many of us are students, teachers, parents, and small business owners. We are members of your community, trying to create a world of equality and freedom for those around us. We are not masked vandals but your neighbors, who are growing gardens, setting up networks of free child care, and serving food to the hungry.

Our immediate demands for the march on Monday were:

1.The firing of Frashour, the officer who murdered Aaron Campbell
2.The firing of Humphrey's the officer who recently shot a 12 year old girl with a bean bag gun on the max.
3.Open negotiations between the Portland Police union and the city.

Abuses extended by police forces are more evident every day. The police exist within this and all countries as the enforcement arm of the socio-political elite class of the state apparatus . There are some who believe strong handed authority is the only way to organize society. Those of us who see the false reality behind the legitimacy of police understand each house-hold, neighborhood, and individual, is equipt with the potential to be their own master. There is not one bad apple, one bad cop, then entire system does not work to protect our communities. Cops do not prevent rape, drugs, murder, or other crimes. Most crimes in society are commited due to economic necessity, and it is up to us as community members. Communities need to create a space where economic crimes are not necessary just so the lower class can survive. This is not a mindless utopian concept, but a recognition that people are better off organizing for themselves and are more capable and knowledgable to do so then rich legislators, who have never experienced our neighborhoods. In rejecting coercive authority, we can re-establish an old paradigm of participatory organizing and mutual aid found throughout many cultures in history. There are community alternatives to violent police authority such as:

-restorative justice
-conflict mediation
-community watch programs
-community spokes councils
-community supported groups and safe centers
-organize yourselves

We can live in a society free of police and state violence if we take on the responsibility as community members of Portland, to recognize there is a systematic problem with the Portland Police Department. The only way this issue is going to be solved is through community organizing, and rejecting police authority. City council, specifically Sam Adams, has proven this to us, by taking no action against two police murders already this year.

Why do anarchists wear masks on their faces during a protest?

Anarchists using the black bloc tactic wear masks for many reasons. The main one is the fact that the police videotape activists for their "Red" files. The police do this surveillance and information-gathering to frighten moderate activists from participation in protests and social struggle. The police do this even when there are laws against it (see red squads). Masks promote anonymity and egalitarianism. Instead of a "leader" yelling instructions to a protest group via a megaphone, those in the bloc make decisions among themselves.

Since all of these "Protesters" seem like they are not happy with the way the police act, maybe they should all start applying to become police officers themselves, instead of throwing temper tantrums in the streets. If you feel that you can do a better job at stopping criminals, then maybe you should prove it. Instead of rejecting police authority, become a better police authority. Then, when one of you or your co-workers fucks up, you'll actually get paid for going to the protest, and you can wave at your friends from a horse as they're yelling at you!
The 'nutso' probably didn't receive the help from professionals; social workers, therapists,doctors ect. BECAUSE THERE IS NO BUDGET FOR IT! 1,000's of people needing mental health help in Oregon are slipping through the cracks. So we will see more cases like this in Oregon and elsewhere thanks to our economy. Money that should have been spent on 'us' instead has gone to Iraq and Afghanistan over the past 7 plus years. Or to bail out big corporations and financial institutions. Let us not forget where our nations priorities have been.
Portland police does not like its citizens. A few years ago a friend of mine who lived in bldg@2255 W Burnside. ( a bldg with a bad history)called 911 to report an intruder. When PPD arrived they called my friend a Liar. They proceeded to take him to jail after he asked for the officer's name and badge number. The charges on my friend were later dropped. My friend said after he asked for name and badge number he watched the officer become enraged. Its this kind of interaction citizens of Portland are tired of. I go out of my way to smile and say hello to police all the time. The main reason I do this is to see what reactionI receive. EVERY single time I get either no reply or a look of disgust. I am a clean cut man in my 40's. So what's up with that?
For the record, I neither smoke pot nor do I play video-games other than the occasional tetris binge. Oh, and Scooby-doo is boring.

I will agree with you that "shitty people often seek out positions of power and do shitty things." This is true. But who else wants to deal with the dregs of society? You? I don't like cops any more than you do, but going out and protesting isn't going to solve anything. It's a waste of time. I don't think it's the cops that are at fault but the current state of the mental health system that allows people to fall through the cracks so much so that things like this happen.

Dear Proslepsis and avamac,
Please make a reasonable statement with the information at hand. Either you agree with the actions of the Portland Police Department, or you do not. Single handedly bashing someone with an opinion is no way to be heard. So before I state mine, I would only request that the debate be drawn to a logical conclusion.
Therefore, I do not agree that the police officer's impulse to shoot the man was the most logical, however, in a tricky situation, any given person can make a mistake. I agree with TageSavage that he was probably trained in a particularly aggressive manner and he acted accordingly. Having so many years on the force though, kind of counteracts this knowledge. He knew better.
But I, for one, would also have shot him. A human life is, after all, a human life. By nature we are impulsive fight or flight creatures. But we also should have the decency and common sense to know when another is not a productive member of our society. If anything, we were paying this man (in taxes) to BE a drug addict and supporting his will to live (i.e. foodstamps). WHAT I ask you, after being on the streets for so long, did this man give back to us? A threat to a police officer...having the nerve to do so in a public facility. Or, being so whacked out of his gorge, that he probably didnt even realize what he was doing, much less realize he was dying.

If you believe in evolution, this may be an example of survival of the fittest. Take it as you will. I am sick of supporting bleeding hearts that do nothing but drag us down. I feel the officer was justified.

Please wait...

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