News Nov 7, 2012 at 4:00 am

Kids Pepper Sprayed at March Against Budget Cuts

A protester rests after being pepper sprayed Saturday.

Comments

1
this is what free speech gets you in our great america .this should also read sponserd by the obama admin
2
I think "wooden banner" is a hilarious euphemism for plywood shields/battering rams. And the police responded by "seasoning" the protesters.
3
Jaywalking is another victimless, so-called crime. This is how the Founding Father's would deal with anyone who would infringe on an American's Rights.

Free Tom Carlston!


http://www.koinlocal6.com/news/local/story/PPB-Officer-assaulted-in-Cully-neighborhood/NbpmuXUA90OZPDuwVgZPUg.cspx
4
@ multnomahn:

assuming that the police account of what happened last night isn't exaggerated or false, are you seriously saying "free tom carlston!"??

yeah, he was jaywalking. and his punishment was getting a few words spoken to him -- it appears that the cop wasn't going to cite him. and then this guy flips out. how can you not be happy to have such a backward-ass fuck off of the streets for a while?
5
Once upon a time, there was a harmless bum, sitting on a bench, minding his own business, in the public, Southwest Park Blocks, between buildings of Portland State University. A PSU Safety Patroller came up to him an told him that he couldn't sit there and that he had to leave. The old man stood right up and knocked the stupid fucking rent a cop, flat on his ass. Then the bum returned to sitting in the same spot, on the same bench that the moron told him he couldn't be.

The PSU Safety Patroller ran away and called the Portland Police Department, who dutifully sent one of their truly finest men. The guard cowered behind the officer as he directed him to the man on the bench. The cop looked at the geezer, and chuckled to the PSU Safety Patroler: "Is this the guy who hit you?" The security guard said: "Yes, that's him." The Policeman laughed out loud and said: "He can be here!"

Anytime anybody infringes on your Rights, even verbally, you are entitled to stand up for yourself physically. The police are not above the law. They have become trigger happy, though. I suppose we are supposed to feel grateful if they don't shoot us for jaywalking or speaking freely. Fuck the police. Eliminate their budget and hire more friendly Rangers.
6
I'll say it again, more clearly this time; jaywalking is NOT a crime. Under Common Law, there is no crime without a victim and without proving INTENT to do harm. Free speech is not a crime either.

Freedom of mobility and freedom of speech are basic Rights.

Any police officer who writes citation under unjust colorable law is in violation of genuine lawful Rights, although he may be just following orders like any loyal NAZI.

What did you think I was going to say again? Fuck the police!
7
Cuts in education? How about starting with Wim Wiewel? Cut his salary, his position, and give him the axe. Draft Teri Marinari as prez, and pay her ten grand more than she got as Athletic Director. Eliminate the PSU Safety Patrollers, and replace them with student workers, the way that work used to be done.

http://psuvanguard.com/feature/pres-wiewel-gets-a-raise/

Pres. Wiewel gets a raise

Isaac Hotchkiss Aug. 8, 2012

State board of higher ed approves a $540,000 maximum salary
8
multnomahn: you are a punchy nutter.

"Anytime anybody infringes on your Rights, even verbally, you are entitled to stand up for yourself physically."

which, by the way, would be infringing on someone else's right not to get assaulted by some violent dumbass for some dumbass, near-arbitrary reason.

dude, we can agree that jaywalking is a trifle. (even, i suppose, if this guy was one of those assholes that just jumps in front of traffic without care or consideration.)

and we can agree, if we have evidence (presently, i don't think we do), that the cop may have been being a little too coppy.

but lending justification for this dude going apeshit over such a trifle, and physically assaulting a cop (or anybody)?

are you fucking kidding me?

you're not as oppressed as you think, multnomahn. relax yourself, man. there are plenty of genuinely fucked-up things happening in this world that need to be addressed and corrected -- but collecting pity for nutjob, punchy-ass fucks like your carlston friend is not one of them. i hope they throw the book at him with true aim.
9
Why didn't the good cop arrest the bum in support of the PSU Safety Patroller, if the bum was wrong in decking the prick?

I'll take the bait.

I personally was assaulted by two PSU Safety Patrollers who I wouldn't let handcuff me. One identified himself as "Public Safety" not a 'Police Officer". Why and the hell would anybody allow a security guard to handcuff them? I was beaten with a baton and pepper maced directly in the eyes, until the guard started coughing his own head off. Afterwards, he said all he wanted to do was to write me a ticket, then he would have un-handcuffed me and let me go. I was even a student at PSU at the time who he had previously given a no trespass citation to, for being in a stairwell on campus after midnight, along with the verbal authorization that it was okay for me to return during normal business hours. So, I thought nothing of being there. I should have gotten it in writing, or been smart enough to go by what the ticket said, and not by what the lying security guard told me.

I was set up for complaining about the $80M cost over run on the recreation center, and the mandatory membership in Higher One accounts that students are unfairly required hold. I also complained a lot about the $100M cost over run on the OHSU Tram as well.

When I was taken to OHSU by ambulance, after being beaten and maced by the PSU Safety Patroller, where the nurse gave me some aspirin, waited for me to regain my vision, then despite my back injury, six OHSU security guards forced me into a wheel chair, wheeled me to the bus stop, and dumped me out of the chair.

I don't believe in suing public institutions as it only punishes the tax payer, but I talked to a couple of lawyers, neither of whom I can afford, who would be happy to sue all the abusive guards personally.
10
Your tax dollars at work. Why pay police to harass jaywalkers and mace peaceful protestors? Is that really the best use of the money, with all the other much more fucked up problems in the World? If the police have nothing more constructive to do, like finding stolen cars, then let them get private jobs guarding parking lots.
11
Right, if the police would have been doing real police work instead of harassing the jaywalker, they wouldn't have gotten what they deserved. It's too bad the public is so chickenshit as to continue paying taxes that support such bullies and let innocent people go to jail.
12
If the police were smart, and most of them aren't, the good ones at least, of which there are some, would put a stop to the abusive ones. Laws are only enforced selectively, and good, smart cops, don't waste anybody's time with bullshit. Budget cuts are in the cards. The police ought to do the weeding out now, in anticipation of what's to come. A minority of bullies in blue, encounter a greater majority than they expect, of good defenders of the Constitution, like Tom Carlston.
13
yeah. that's all fine and well. i still think that the bum in your story was in the wrong in automatically resorting to assault -- we don't have to be fucking monkeys about things.

and you resisting being handcuffed, whether it was a bona fide cop or not, and whether they were in the wrong or not, is stupid and unnecessary. and it got you maced and beaten. if you would've just chilled the fuck out, he would've given you the ticket and left. and if what you say is true, then you could've successfully appealed the ticket.

even if he was an asshole, and even if you failed to have the ticket overturned, and even if you *were* set up, isn't all of that still better than unnecessarily getting the shit kicked out of you, thus helping to turn you into a cynical hot-head who baselessly hates ALL authority?

deal with it another way, dude. with your fucking head. legally and intelligently. once you get all punchy, you lose all credibility and legal standing. you're lucky that they didn't charge you with assault.

and who paid for that ambulance (the ambulance that wouldn't've been necessary had you calmed the fuck down)? did you pay for it? isn't that punishing the taxpayer?
14
@ dim weasel:

laugh-out-fucking-loud!!

did you just say that tom carlston is a "good defender of the constitution"??

for beating the shit out of a cop who had told him to be careful crossing the street??

wow.

fucking wow.
15
I got the bill for the private ambulance, but the PSU Safety Patrollers complained more to their doctors than I did to mine. I still haven't paid the ambulance, so, all in all, I'd have to say that the PSU Safety Patrollers taking twenty minutes of me going easy on them, still got the worst of it. What I learned from that, is the truth of what my grandteacher said: "Mercy to your enemy is punishment to yourself." I won't make that mistake again.
16
I agree with Dim. People have allowed so many Rights to be eroded that they feel as if other people actually have the right to boss them around; they don't. Martial arts book publishers are so afraid of frivolous lawsuits that the reader is invariable subjected to the disclaimer, not to use excessive force or they could end up persecuted.

As far as I'm concerned, there is no way to ascertain what intentions any attacker really has, so the safest course of action is total incapacitation of the offender. Likewise, anyone so bold as to try and intimidate someone into abdicating their rights, needs to be dropped on the spot like a bag of wet cement.

The mistake I made with the PSU Safety Patrollers, was that since they weren't police, and didn't have the grounds nor the authority to handcuff me, that they wouldn't actually escalate it. It never even occurred to me that they would even consider such a stupid act. I really tried my best not to hurt them, but that was what was really stupid.

All I can say is, the next time that any abusive guard or cop, thinks of making a move on me, they'd better get a second opinion; from the CERT Team.
17
The old man in the park, must also have learned from experience.
18
this is exactly why i think cops and security guards are underpaid -- they have to worry about i'm-so-oppressed types like you that will try to beat the shit out of them at word one.

yes, there are bad cops. yes, there are corrupt cops. yes, cops are fallible. yes, they sometimes overreact. but the same can be said of us.

in this instance, a cop told some dude that he should use the crosswalk from now on. and for that, he got a nasty gash in the head requiring staples to close it. if you don't think that's a problem, and that the man responsible shouldn't be thrown in stir, then you're both an asshole and a liability to civilized culture.

there are plenty of instances in which cops overstep their bounds and become criminals themselves, but this doesn't appear to be one of them. dude could've died. they're not all 'pigs'.
19
There are three kinds of law. There is God's Law, which is to do the right thing. Then there is Man's Law, which is to do as you say that you will do. The police officer was attempting to enforce vulgar code, which is to do as you're told. That weak cop probably would round up all the Jews and send them all off to the gas chambers, it that's the way the code were written. He's a total pig, and ought to be the first to lose his job when the pending budget cuts are enacted. It's good we know his name.
20
those poor kids :(
21
Multnomahn, imagine, for a second, that you are a cop. Now imagine that you are faced with a person who moves toward you aggressively. Now remember that you believe, "As far as I'm concerned, there is no way to ascertain what intentions any attacker really has, so the safest course of action is total incapacitation of the offender." What do you think the outcome would be? My guess, you would be the kind of cop that just shot people in the face instead of asking questions.

My point with this is that you allow yourself a freedom to be violent that you would deny to others.

Also, H.I.T. is exactly right from top to bottom on this thread.
22
The cop was wrong to infringe upon the Right of the innocent citizen's freedom of movement. The cop is the criminal here, who started the shit in the first place. The citizen was protecting his Rights and defending The Constitution of the United States of America against a domestic enemy.
23
Multnomahn, do you feel the same way about laws that require people to drive on the right side of the road? Would you argue that a citizen's "freedom of movement" includes the right to choose which side of the road to drive on? If not, why not? What makes that different?
24
If I had the money, I'd post bail for Tom Carlston and give a generous retainer to Ivan Karmel to start a class action against the Portland Police Department for numerous civil rights violations.
25
Have you seen how people drive in Mexico? Of course you have. They are the same drunken, illegal aliens that hit and run bicyclists here in Portland.

As long as there is no collision, then speed limits and rules of the road are advisory only. However, if there is an accident where a warning has been posted, then it's not as if the defendant could very well plead ignorance. Personally, I wish the leash law would be enforced, but as long as some stinking dog doesn't come rub against me, or growl at me, or bite me, or shit all over the fucking park so that nobody can have a proper picnic, then I have to admit that there is no harm done, and the law is abusive.
26
Of course a dog is a lethal weapon, and when a dog comes running towards me, I have no way to ascertain if it intends to attack or merely wants to play. There have been more than a few incidences, nation wide, of off duty cops, usually out jogging, who encounter off leash barking dogs, that end up with a clip full of 9mm caps busted in their crown.
27
multnomahn:

my cynicism has no bounds, so i still believe that you're being serious.

tom carlston is a raging loon -- we know this even based on just this one incident. if you approached him to voice your support for him, he'd probably beat the shit out of you, too, assuming that you were about to infringe on his precious freedom of movement by speaking words to him.

then, bloodied and surprised, you would fight back, creating a situation wherein you would both be 'defending the constitution' while simultaneously knocking the living crap out of each other.

deep stuff.

you are both courageous freedom fighters, and oh-so oppressed and under-appreciated.

i wonder: does kickstarter allow fund-raising campaigns for gifts of lobotomies & vasectomies?
28
Your humorous hypothetical comments fairly illustrate the intent of vulgar code; to punish an innocent citizen before any possible infraction. Why not just cut off pedestrians legs so that then they won't be able to jay walk?
29
or his balls so that he won't be able to taint this earth any further.
30
Multnomahn, your vision of the legal system is fascinating. This may be my favorite thing ever written: "As long as there is no collision, then speed limits and rules of the road are advisory only. However, if there is an accident where a warning has been posted, then it's not as if the defendant could very well plead ignorance." If you have the time, please answer a couple more questions for me. How do you feel about laws that punish "conspiracy"? What about "attempt"? Do you think that these are crimes at all, even though they may not have a victim yet? For example, if someone shoots a gun aimed near someone's head, but not at it, do you think that's a crime?

Also, I'm really interested in how you categorize laws. You mentioned that there are only three kinds of laws: god's, man's and vulgar code. But you also say that jaywalking isn't a crime because it's not a common law crime. So, where does the common law fit into your three categories? Also, why is common law different from vulgar code? is it because judges make common law, but the Legislature makes vulgar code? What do you think that laws made my judges are so much more valid than laws made by legislatures?
31
Common Law is God's Law; where Rights originate. It is the basis for the Magna Carta, the Declaration of Independence, and the constitutions for the Original Thirteen States. Common Law is the basis of the Bill of Rights and the Constitution for the United States of America, with the exception therein for the use of Admiralty Law, which is Roman Law, which is Statutory Law; Vulgar Code. Admiralty Law was included in the Constitution for the purpose of dealing with insurance claims for damages due to piracy at Sea. The Muslims of the Barbary Coast were a major hindrance to commerce at the time of the writing of the Constitution. It wasn't until the end of Lincoln's War that Admiralty Law was brought inland to be used against civilians.
36
[Comment Pulled: TOS violation]
37
(sorry, sarah -- i feel somewhat responsible for this -- i should've just let it roll right off.)
38
That was building up. It took me awhile, but I needed to exercise a bit of restraint. Abusive, fucking pricks.
39
Under Common Law, offenses as committed by the police as reported in the above article, if found guilty by a jury, would likely be sentenced to hanging until dead.
40
If I were one of those criminal police officers, I would not even wait for my final paycheck, or give final notice. I would not return to work, leave the country, and change my name, like Hilarity Clinton.
41
Thank you Multnomahn. That was a wonderful read.
42
There is a special place in Hell, for teachers such as Tom Hastings.
43
"The Right to bear arms is not subject to regulation."
--Multnomahn


The Bill of Rights
Amendment II
A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/charters/bill_of_rights_transcript.html
44
The Second Amendment states the the "Right" shall not be infringed. Rights by their very nature, are inalienable. The term, "well regulated" in proper context, means able to be put in good order. If the people aren't armed, then they can't form a proper militia of their own accord.


http://www.webster1828.com/definition.aspx?word=Regulated

Regulated

pp. Adjusted by rule, method or forms; put in good order; subjected to rules or restrictions.
45
Gun permits? Not required. Automatic weapons registration? Abusive bureaucracy. Concealed carry permit? Even nunchakus and katanas are protected by the citizens brave enough to defend their inalienable Rights.
46
Multnomahn, what about nuclear, biological, and chemical arms? Any thoughts on our right to bear them?
47
Very astute, Torgo,

Yes, aside from individual self defense, protection of family and property and even hunting, the primary intent for the Right to bear arms is to keep government from becoming dictatorial. At the time that the Constitution was signed, the authors had probably never imagined anything the likes of modern weapons of mass destruction. Today, government could wipe out all of it's citizens, all at once or one by one, simply by boosting the transmission power to cell phones.

Now that governments are in possession of thermonuclear bombs, does the Second Amendment establish the Right for each and every citizen to carry around their very, own, suitcase nuke?

Professor Ted Kaczynski, Phd is a true visionary. A man ahead of his time. He has perfectly foreseen and foretold of the inevitable catastrophic results of high tech society. His prescription was futile, but his heart was in the right place. As an aside, I sincerely doubt that he entitled his last published white paper, a "manifesto", and I am certain that he didn't call himself, "The Unabomber". The press or the FBI or somebody else first started calling the culprit that committed the crimes for which he was convicted by that moniker, for bombing academics at universities, but university is spelled with an i not an a, and besides, the term doesn't accurately describe Ted's mission.

We have crossed the Rubicon. The jin is out of the bottle. All of the dominoes are in place for the big, end game.
48
If we attempt to over throw City Hall and/or, everybody tries the same in their own home towns, we will have also destroyed our cushy standard of living in the process, at the least. If we tolerate Portland becoming a partner with Homeland Security, and mandated by Barry O'bamass' Executive Order,

http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2012/10/26/executive-order-establishing-white-house-homeland-security-partnership-c

of October 26th, then we have lost even more freedom. This is how Hitler gradually built his dictatorship in NAZI Germany. We are in a no-win situation.


http://www.financialsensearchive.com/stormwatch/geo/pastanalysis/2009/0828.html

http://www.financialsense.com/contributors/jr-nyquist/confirmation-of-the-sequence

http://www.financialsense.com/contributors/jr-nyquist/those-who-know-will-understand
49
What were the first words to come out of the mouth of President G Dub'ya's mouth, damned near, right after 911? "...and for God's sake keep shopping." If everybody were smart, they'd leave the country like Hilarity has done, but then who would be left to do the dirty work?
50
Fukushima is still irradiating the West Coast. Think Southern Hemisphere. The jet stream seems to keep the the air separated at the Equator. Of course, Great Britain has recently sent nuclear armed ships to Argentina to protect Falkland oil ...ah, British citizens, there.
51
Why would England need nuclear weapons to use against Argentina? Could there be any truth to the rumor, that NAZI scientists escaped Germany in anti-gravity saucers, before the OSS co-opted Hitlers other scientist who were building rockets?
52
What if everybody were to abandon Portland, and nothing bad happens; not even the past due 9.2? Would we have destroyed our economy for no reason? What if we were to all convert to Islam and switch to Communism; would our enemies go away? How does Saudi Arabia get along with Iran? How does Russia get along with Georgia?
53
You'll have to excuse me. I'm getting a bit verklempt. Talk amongst yourselves.
54
If the Space NAZIS have anti-gravity saucers, do you think they are fueled by petroleum products, or are they using some sort of zero point energy? If free energy were a reality would the resulting abundance create World peace, or make it possible for aspiring James Bond villains to emerge?
55
No jaywalking, though.
56
Where is Tokyo Rose, now, when we need her the most?
57
[Comment deleted: Off Topic.]
58
Interesting. 30 more posts, please.
59
If there were only some way to edit posts to make one bid, long one. Is that really all you have to say, Torgo? This may be the last I ever have to say, and the only warning any of you are going to read.

Please wait...

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