NO! Bad idea PSU!

From the story: "The big problem is not lack of police officers, but rape culture. What we need to support is making women feel safe," said Sarah Levy, a member of PSU's International Socialist Organization.

Ms. Levy, if you happen to read this, you are right. However, until you have a way to force sexual predators to think differently, we are going to have to try to force them to stop acting on the thoughts they have. That is what police are for. Let us know when you've got that anti-sexual-predator-mind-control device working. I'll gladly support a reduction in the police force then.


Also, DamosA, I applaud your consistency. I don't agree with you, but at least you're consistent. Anti-cop to the bitter, anarchic end. By the way, do you ever give testimony at City Council meetings? I would be interested to see a little back and forth between you and them, and I might take an afternoon off to see the festivities.

I too would like to see Clifton Brooks deliver testimony in an adjudicated forum that doesn't allow for name-calling. I personally doubt he has the guts or the intelligence to accomplish such a thing.

Graham:

"An adjudicated forum that doesn't allow for name-calling"? Have you been to a City Council meeting? Also, I have no doubt that he has the "guts" to deliver testimony. And having been to a few of these meetings, I can say that intelligence is not at all relevant (I make no judgement as to DamosA's intellect, I do not know him well enough for that). Frankly, I was being serious, as it wouldn't surprise me in the least if he regularly testified at City Council meetings. Most of the time, the meetings are excruciatingly dull, with long periods of the Council honoring various tiny groups of people for one thing or another. But every once in a while, when things get heated, the discussion is a lot of fun to watch. It's fun for the same reason that it's fun to read the comments on the Mercury. I'm interested in DamosA testifying only because I'm sure that he would disagree with them about almost everything they said, and that makes for a good time.

Fyi dickhead ... I'm sorry, that was mean and counter-productive - i take it back.


Fyi, i HAVE attended and testified at city council meetings before. Not nearly as often as i'd prefer (mostly do to school/work), but i have.

But anyways, i just think it's real funny you know... people still are under this impression that MORE cops = MORE security and greater safety. I've said this before in a blog post relating this very article: if citizens decline to take responsibility for their OWN security and hand it all off to MORE cops in order to feel safe - what you have is LESS safety, LESS security, and MORE FUCKING COPS!

At one point Germany was the most secure place on Earth - roughly b/t 1932 - 1944. Security and state police EVERYWHERE keeping the people "safe".

ahh, hitler and nazis.....yes, damosa, that's EXACTLY how it will be. we'll be exactly like the nazis; we'll be the 'american nazis of the new millennium' the very second we add a few security guards on campus.

and then will come the gas chambers and book-burnings -- all of this stuff will be unavoidable once we allow ourselves to pass the fail/safe-threshold-ratio of security officers to students. to wit, the article says there are 17 guards for the 30,000 students -- if we add more than 13 more guards to that 17, that would bring the ratio to 1/3,000, which, as you very well know, will inevitably lead to dictatorship and bellicose nationalism.

then will come the aliens, who will immediately forge a friendship with the new nazis.....then we'll all be totally, totally, TOTALLY fucked. (for several reasons, but mostly because they have lazers.)

and just think: all of that can be avoided by simply turning our heads and allowing a couple of gals to get raped every once in a while for lack of proper (nazi) security.

You know what?


It's folks like YOU who're the very reason Hitler rose to power in the first place! I want you to know that.

Just curious if any of the comments posted so far were by women or men, students or non-students, people who live/work in the PSU area, or not. I've worked in public safety and a heightened police presence can be an effective deterent to crime. Also, for the victim, it's much more reassuring to know that police won't take forever to show up. Of course the concerns over police behavior during protests are valid and would require appropriate training and policy to avoid disgusting behavior like in UC Davis. But I think the seriousness of the issue warrants more serious discussion than devolving into conflated fears of Nazi Germany, the irrelevant goings on at city council meetings, and the "I know you are but what am I?" type blather.

I work on Campus and would welcome an increase in security. It makes sense. There is an unusual amount of crime -- I've been solicited for handgun purchases in the parking garage, a number of women have been assaulted in adjacent buildings, clearly imbalanced people regularly wander into the office and make a scene. It'd be helpful to have a swift security response so that front desk staff don't have to endure the brunt of a lot of creepy business without support. People working on the weekends have an especially difficult time -- the campus is nearly empty and security response is very slow.

But then again, I'm an obvious and well-known Nazi.

The PSU Safety Patrollers can only brutalize indigent little old ladies. Despite how many bums they run off the city sidewalks in Southwest Portland, they can't do shit to prevent actual crime. The correct solution, would be a return to having PSU security guards be student employee jobs, to be supplemented with two, Oregon State Police officers on campus at all times.

I suspect that this story is phony, however. I find it very hard to believe, that a rape victim would call the PSU Safety Patrollers, rather than the real police. PSU made this hogwash up, as pretext to build a Gestapo. I would never believe anything reported by Portland State University, in the first place.

The best thing to do, would be to eliminate Portland State University. The savings to tax payers would be well worth it, in and of itself.

PSU isn't increasing its police staff because of sexual assaults alone -- it feels the need to make a safer environment for its students, which they deserve.

And yes, more police on campus will lower crime. I know, the anti-police people will probably down vote me for saying that, but the truth is if you've ever been a victim of a crime, you wouldn't hesitate to call the police. I was a victim of a crime where the person was miles away, I have never felt more violated in my life and I cannot imagine how that female feels (and will forever feel) her entire life from now on.

If you don't like the police, that's fine, just prove it by never calling them ever again in your life. But I know if you had a gun stuffed in your face or were in a serious life and death situation, you'd be the first to call without a thought.

All I ask is to eat your own feedback. Don't just whine about the police and how terrible the police are, PROVE it by your actions too. I can at least respect that stance, even if I disagree with it because I have personally benefited from the police before. Not that they're perfect, but they're an essential urban service most sane people want.

I was a security guard protecitng a witness who had been intimidated in the Brooke Wilberger grand jury investigation. She was an athletic, young, blonde college student, same as Brooke. There were many athletic, young, blonde college students who lived in the same apartment complex where the witness lived. The police were using them all as bait, and didn't tell any of them. Anytime I would call the police about trespassers, they would come out, but never catch anybody, and really didn't appreciate me even calling them. There is still an accomplice out on the loose. People need to be prepared to defend themselves, because no matter how many abusive cops there are, there is never one around until it's too late for them to do any good.

For all you scared naive dummies who are convinced that more cops = greater safety for students - particularly female students - on campus, it may do you well to read this:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012…

DamosA - That article can be countered by countless other news stories of cops arresting criminals and saving lives. You may have heard the recent story of the NYC cop who bought a pair of shoes and socks for a homeless man. But if we logically followed your reasoning: that because some cops do bad things, because one nation went nuts, all police are bad - then people should never eat food because sometimes it has e-coli and makes them sick and they die. Your argument just isn't rational. But perhaps you have an alternative solution you'd like to offer, rather than more insults to anyone who disagrees with you (which is immature and does nothing to advance your argument). BTW, how does a larger police presence affect you personally? Do you attend PSU, or live in the neighborhood? Have you ever been in need of the police, been the victim of a crime? Have you ever been mistreated by the police?

"The city is your campus." With the school located in the heart of the city, you have to expect all sorts of riff raft. Move the school to Scapoose if you want a more peaceful campus, or better yet, put the entire program exclusively online. That's the trend anyway.

Why does PSU need it's own police force? The PPD is already right downtown. The County has plenty of deputies right downtown. PSU is a state university. The state already has it's own police force. The only reason for the PSU Safety Patrollers to carry guns is ego. However, the PSU president might like to have a Gestapo which reports directly to him.

I will say this, however. If a security guard want's to carry a gun. then they ought to get a concealed carry permit. There may be policy against this, but as long as they don't go brandishing a weapon under everybody's nose, then there isn't a problem. If you give those cowboys sidearms, then they will feel entitled to use them at will.

Students, likewise, ought to pack heat. Fuck the school rules. PSU operates under the legal veneer of the State Legislature having legislated their authority to the state system of higher education. This means that school rules have the full force and effect of law. Except that's bullshit. The legislature can't legislate away it's own authority. A state senator can't say that he doesn't feel like going to work today, so his cousin is going to take his place, for instance. The problem is, that the people don't hold government accountable for anything.

The police and the FBI still haven't completely solved the case of the Brooke Wilberger murder. Did you get that? There were at least three suspects, and they are all likely associated with each other. It may even be the work of some sort of a larger crime ring or cult.

Theodora,

A technical point: You're wrong when you say that, "The legislature can't legislate away it's own authority." The delegation of legislative authority has been a regular feature of the federal government since the 1820s. That's what every "regulation" is. It's the executive branch exercising the legislative power delegated to it by Congress. The same is true at the state level here in Oregon. As for the example you describe of a senator deciding to take the day off and install his cousin, you're right that he couldn't do that on his own. However, if the Senate voted to establish an internal procedure which allowed a senator to appoint a temporary proxy, I think that might be allowed. I doubt that it's been tried, so it's hard to say, but each chamber of the Assembly is allowed to establish it's own rules of procedure, and this may be within that Constitutional limit.

If you're curious, the Government Printing Office has this website:

http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/browse/collection…

There you will find many thousands of pages of the executive branch exercising delegated legislative authority.

Also, this is a pretty good summary of the bounds of federal legislative delegation:

http://law.onecle.com/constitution/article…

They will have all of the citations and research that I don't have the time to put in to a comment on the Mercury.

Again, I know that this is mostly related to the federal government. That's just because it's easier to find on short notice. Delegation in the State of Oregon follows similar rules, established over a similar timeline.


(Everyone else: Please don't assume that because I only wrote about this one technical point that I endorse everything else in Theodora's comments. I do not. I only had time to write about this one thing. Theodora has a lot of crazy in those posts, and it would take a lot of time to fully unpack all of it.)

I was afraid you were going to bring that up, Torgo. Executive orders are illegitimate. We really don't need to put up this sort of bullshit. The native American dude posted links about the 14th Amendment and Martial Rule here, butt somebody mysteriously deleted them.

http://ecclesia.org/lawgiver/menufed.asp#f

http://ecclesia.org/forum/uploads/bondserv…

http://ecclesia.org/forum/uploads/bondserv…

http://ecclesia.org/forum/uploads/bondserv…

http://ecclesia.org/forum/uploads/bondserv…

http://mises.org/etexts/ourenemy.pdf

The US Government Printing Office can go suck shit. It's the Declaration of Independence, the Original Constitution of the United States of America, including the Original Bill of Rights, that counts.

Thanks for those links, Theodora. I'm eager to read hundreds of pages of badly edited, multicolored rubbish posted by someone who doesn't know the difference between "but" and "butt" (see 2:06 pm).
Your theories about a PSU lying in order to build its own "Gestapo" are truly compelling. You and DamosA are right: everyone ought to be responsible for their own security and "pack heat" (merely typing that phrase feels totally sweet) -- just like the Old West!

It all comes down to taking personal responsibility. The PSU Safety Patorollers were not there to protect that girl, even if they were to have had guns; if we can even believe that story at all. If the supposed victim were to be carrying a gun, and had more awareness of her surroundings, she might not have been a victim in the first place. If she had called the police instead of worthless security guards, maybe the perpetrator might not have had as much time to get so far away. Eliminate the middle man. If you can't even take responsibility to READ, then you are probably too lazy to learn self defense and how to shoot. That still doesn't increase efficiency of fat assed PSU Safety Patrollers.

There is no need to reinvent the wheel. The PSU Safety Patrollers have already developed too many bad habits. Eliminate them. Portland State University is part of the Oregon State System of Higher Education. The State of Oregon already has a well trained professional police force. A couple of state troopers on campus per shift ought to be enough for first response, in supplement to unarmed student employees to serve as watchmen. Just enough checks and balances to keep each other and the Portland Police Department honest.

One more thing. I know, I could go on and on and generally do, buttt those uniforms... The PSU Safety Patrollers watch waaaay too much TV. Just let student employees be watchmen and wear kevlar vests or something to let students and visitors know that they are there to be helpful, not there to try and catch them at sleeping in a stairwell in order to mace them in the eyes.

Since some of yall love cops soo damned much then, why don't YALL sign up and join the academy???

The US Government Printing Office can go suck shit. It's the Declaration of Independence, the Original Constitution of the United States of America, including the Original Bill of Rights, that counts.
Thank you
Bizworldusa

Great reporting! I liked your coverage. I am a student at Clackamas Community College and the Co Editor in Chief at the Clackamas Print and have reported on Campus Safety here.
have enjoyed reading Sarah Mirk's coverage

Joshua Dillen

Wait... they has a college in Clackamas County? I did not know Clackamas folk were into all that dar book learnin'. Sounds like Portland Creep to me.

Like I said in the post before, anyone who hates cops so much can feel free to never call them ever -- under any circumstance -- again in your life.

Talk is cheap, you know. Actions speak louder.

well, we've finally found someone as obviously crazy as DamosA it seems.
Thank You 'Dr.'...

"Like I said in the post before, anyone who hates cops so much can feel free to never call them ever -- under any circumstance -- again in your life."


I'll have you know sir, that i myself have not called the pigs in years, and never attend to again! So yes, you're right - actions DO speak louder!

Damosa:

If you were bludgeoned over the head and sexually assaulted at night in the dark, you'd call the police. Get over yourself, internet tough guy.

I reminded of those "how not to get raped on campus" workshops they have every year at some schools. I wonder why they never teach a "don't rape" one.

And for the record: Cops don't prevent crime they respond to it.

Tillamook:

I have amazing clairvoyance to know if you've ever been a victim of a serious crime, most sane people would do anything to get that person off the street and would spur at least an investigation, even if you had negative views of the police or were skeptical.

Fortunately, most people aren't victims of serious crimes, so they can smugly maintain their view that we need "community watchers," or some other pacified anarchist bullshit, instead of actual armed and uniformed patrol men and women.

Having a gun pointed in your face is the best cure for smugness.

@disatronaught

Police presence does prevent crime. Do you think a person will rob a bank if there's 10 armed police officers outside of said bank? Doubtful.

@ ws,


that is where you are WRONG, sir!

First , I don't want to invalidate the tragedy endured by the woman who survived her attacker/rapist nor do I want to come across as anti-police. And yes, my brother was murdered and I have experienced crimes against me so please refrain from using fallacies to support your opinions. Mine at least has some real experience.

My first reaction to Cops on Campus and giving them guns was"what are they thinking?" Please let me explain before making a judgement. I have only my experience and the track record of PSU faculty's misuse of CPSO and other resources hysterically reacting to and in some cases abusing students who challenged their authority or in some manner "disrespected" them.
Having police with guns to replace security guards won't reduce crime,rather it will increase the abuse of authority by faculty who enlist the support of CPSO (much to their annoyance) and people like Michelle Toppe , every time they hysterically react to a student with the courage to challenge their abusive behavior. I know because the social work school did it to me. In retaliation for my filing a grievance and litigation several faculty went to Michelle Toppe and without any conduct code violations, or credible, rational threat,sent defamatory emails to all GSSW students and faculty instructing them to call CPSO if I was not only seen on campus but if anyone had appointments with me outside school in the community. I wasn't trespassed from campus and never threatened to harm anyone. They just wanted to isolated me from witnesses, defame me to discredit my testimony and avoid being accountable for violating my rights.Michelle Toppe assisted their efforts acting as a consultant.As the director of a nonprofit providing batterer intervention services my reputation was in serious jeopardy.
That aside,the students like the courageous young woman deserve a better run system with accountability and quality assurances outside the confines of the thickly insulated, non transparent walls of academia. I can see these armed police responding to ridiculous requests for "a security escort" from faculty, fearing retaliation because they know they did something wrong to a student while a real crime is happening elsewhere.Without very clear guidelines and protocols regarding what is or isn't a legitimate threat, police on campus won't make a difference and could be used to further the agendas of rogue, hysterical, angry faculty placing an unsuspecting student in harms way.

Well thought out, Phil. Thank you.

I say let them get the guns, shoot everybody in sight, and then PSU will get the backlash they've got coming already.