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I love comedy open mics because they are a work-out room to sweat out new material. The creative process of birthing jokes is so beautiful; I rarely mind the joke placenta. However, the comedy scene in Portland is so sweet it leaves cupcake shops in its wake, and this often means that clubs will let anyone go onstage at an open mic, no matter how horrendous. A few days ago, towards the end of a mic, a comic who I sorta knew was telling street jokes. (What do you get when you cross a blank with a blank… etcetera.) I was sitting there quietly, minding my own business, trying to get in some good daydream time. Then the comedian started telling a rape joke. He paused and said angrily, “Have you noticed that Barbara Holm never laughs at rape jokes, no matter how funny? She laughs at feminist jokes but no rape jokes. Come on, why don’t you laugh, Barbara?” My least favorite piece of misogyny ever, to date, was that moment.

First of all, my laugh is a privilege, not a right—like being bitten by a werewolf, not for everybody. I am short, bespectacled, and shy, but that does NOT mean you are entitled to my approval. I know I look like I should be grateful for any attention from men, but that’s the difference between men and kitty cats. It was such a direct attack with an uneven distribution of power, because he was on an elevated stage with a microphone and a spotlight, and I was the only one he called out.

Second, it’s not simply that I hate rape jokes. I hate rape jokes that are directed at the victim. They are mean spirited, and often dumb. So, yelling and trying to manipulate is exactly counter-intuitive to selling someone on rape culture. That’s like saying, “Oh, you think informed consent is a universal human right? I’m going to force you to change your mind.” I hate the perpetuation of rape culture in entertainment rhetoric, and I really loathe when people try to aggressively manipulate this core belief.

This is not the first time a comic has gotten mad at me for not liking their act. In the dark city of Seattle, a comic told a joke about beating his girlfriend, and I happened to be in the front row, so he berated me verbally for not laughing. It’s even happened a few times since I moved to this magickal fairyland. It irks me because it feels like someone is attacking my right to my own opinions, taste, and beliefs. Why does it matter so much that I don’t think you’re funny? And instead of expressing aggression and rage toward me, here’s a thought: You could just be funny.

I think comedy is the most beautiful art form. I think that jokes can be used to make people feel better and less alone. Laughter has a strong emotional power over people, and it’s heartbreaking to see that powerful rhetoric used to perpetuate violence or cruelty. I hate being bullied, and I hate watching anyone feel bullied. The art of stand up can be a very pure and altruistic medium. It has helped me deal with depression and anxiety and I genuinely believe it can make the world a better place. That’s been my least favorite piece of misogyny this week—tune in next week to let me pet your dog.

121 replies on “My Least Favorite Piece of Misogyny This Week: Comedy Bullies”

  1. I will be in solidarity in not laughing at rape jokes. Like white skinny jeans, there are very few people that can pull off rape jokes and not look stupid.

  4. I was going to send you a Facebook message saying that I am sorry I went after you, that room was strange, and I had to go on last and I could have not run my mouth… but instead, I got to read this… so it’s good that I can save that message. I usually try to resolve conflicts person to person like a grown up, ya know rather than taking it to a public forum and complaining and only furthering the problem. so kudos to you for showing me a lack of character, it helps me, make calls regarding you later in life. to be clear I was not bullying you, I was calling you on something… something that annoys more people than just myself, everyone does stuff that annoys people… knowing about it is good… granted I could have had more tact than saying on stage in front of 7 people, furthermore I referenced a rape, I don’t think I made fun of the rape victim, I implied it was the worst thing you can do… I think, to be honest I don’t remember that well, as I was just talking, and didn’t really think much about, but when the ear radar of things I refuse to laugh at goes off it matters not how funny it is, even if you miss the point you are still going to be shitty about it.

    Personally I think your view of comedy is skewed, your view of being bullied is more skewed, I have been bullied, what happened to you was just a simple comment, its not bullying but since you don’t understand the difference, what is the point. Furthermore of the jokes were formula jokes not street jokes there is a difference, you don’t write street jokes IE dead baby jokes, or 3 different things walk into a bar one is [racist comment here] or my favorite what do elephants and ice cream have in common.

    Remember also I know you were laughing at the majority of my set, because I was within a mile or so of you, and I could hear your laughs, so paint me however you want, the fact is this you weren’t being bullied, you have way more Portland cred than I have, you can bully me, not vice verse, also I love how if you don’t like something you can paint it as this woman hating shit, but the truth is that wasn’t what happened at all and I can only hope you understand that. calling you on something, is way way way different than pushing you around and picking on you, I said my piece, and if you had let it be or even said how you felt about it, this could have had a happy ending, instead this… wonderful piece of shit came of it.

  5. Look pal, you did something pretty much fucked up when you were gifted an open forum to tell your bad jokes. Your unwillingness to apologize really illustrates your lack of character and your telling of rape jokes really illustrates your inability to write a good joke, so fuck off.

  8. Dude, you had the opportunity to seize the golden ring of personal growth and you wrote that instead? You will not be looking back on this as one of your best moments. If you wrote it to get something out of your system, fine, but now delete it. It does no one any good.

  10. the super funny thing is that nobody except that audience of 7 ever would have known it was you, if you hadn’t gotten all butt-hurt …

  11. Will, buddy, just stop. That rant isn’t helping you any. You are not the bully police, you don’t get to tell anyone how they feel about how they were treated.

  13. I think Bobby said it best and god knows since my day has been crap and since Barbara didn’t fucking name you I’m going to sit here and watch you screw your career up. This is way beyond douchey and one of the greatest things to me is I would have never know who you were Will if your did not post that. Whats even better is you should have taken care of that THAT night if you felt bad.

  14. Dear smiley face, I’m not your pal, as I don’t associate with dipshits. And you can say whatever you like about me, as I have the right and responsibility to not respect your anonamus(or otherwise)opinion. PS I talk about everything from building 7 to chess in my act, as hard as it is to fathom, my act isn’t just rapey rape rape.

  15. I don’t understand how comedy and sensitivity go together. It’s jokes. If you don’t think a joke is funny don’t react to it or maybe groan and make a face palm. Laugh or don’t laugh but don’t have a freak out because somebody told a joke that offended you. It’s comedy not child snuff pornography. It is nearly impossible to tell a joke without potentially offending someone. Getting overly offended at somebody else’s attempt at humor is pretending like your shit doesn’t stink. Any joke potentially offends some group or person but to act like only your feelings matter is to delude yourself that your viewpoint is the only valid viewpoint. Different people believe different things. Trying to not offend anyone at all is generally not the point of comedy. Joking about a subject is not the same as endorsing or condoning it. Some people enjoy humor that is decidedly horrible and pushes every boundary of what would be socially acceptable. Some people eat meat. Some people hate cats. Some people like to listen to gangster rap. Some people like gospel music.

    Personally, religious zealots offend the shit out of me. I hate it when some asshole shows up on my porch trying to show me the light. Whether or not they are aware of the connotations of their own actions they are subtly implying that I am too ignorant to form my own opinions about what I choose to believe in. They are implying that I am too weak to make my own way in life without the comforting embrace and guidance of somebody wiser than me. Somebody they fortunately happen to know but I do not. I kindly tell those people (the first time) that I am not interested, to have a nice day, and I shut the door in their face. I don’t have to scream at them to go fuck themselves. I don’t threaten to sacrifice them to Satan, no matter how much it would help me fulfill the blood quota of my Goetian contracts. I would have to dispose of even more bodies and it also isn’t nice.

    Comedy should be about having a good time and letting disparate views coexist or at least checking your personal baggage at the door. You decided to sit down and listen to somebody try to be funny. Maybe they failed inyour opinion. Nobody dragged you into the bushes and whispered clown suit jokes in your ear. Somebody being not funny or telling jokes that you personally don’t like is not somebody physically attacking you. Sitting in the front row at a comedy show can also make you fair game. Some comic’s whole shtick revolves around making fun of the audience. Big deal, laugh it off or ignore it. If people get easily offended at any remark referencing a subject they perceive to be “politically incorrect” they should stay home and watch Nickelodeon.

  16. Trollkien, all she did was not laugh – she simply minded her own business – then the “comedian” called her out by name. And after that she wrote a column about the boorish behavior of the comedian. Behavior which has continued on this page, and probably will continue until he gets his ass kicked out of town.

    You’re fucked, Will. As of right now, your comment has only been up for a few hours at a time during which few people are reading Blogtown. This will blow up over the next few days, and you should not mistake the few positive comments and emails you get for meaningful community support. The old adage that all publicity is good publicity? Not true, especially when you’re still playing to crowds of half a dozen people.

    I’m gonna go make some popcorn. With brewer’s yeast. And while I eat it, I’m going to get a consensual blowjob. From a woman. It’ll be awesome.

  19. My meaningless rambling diatribe wasn’t any kind of an endorsement of whoever this guy is. It just seems like this column is the same thing every week and it doesn’t really make any sense to me. It actually isn’t anything against Barbara Holm really because I don’t know her and wouldn’t want to be mean to her. I don’t think raping people or being a dick is acceptable either but I think the world would be a better place if more people were not offended by petty shit. I also think if you have the ability to publish public discourse than the public has the right to critique it.

    Plus alcohol.

  20. It sounds to me that she was more offended by his calling her out by name specifically in the shittiest of fashions. She didn’t laugh, he took offence and tried to turn it around and make it something wrong with her instead of his dying line of jokes.

    To which she rightly felt the need to rant about the random obnoxious ass in her blog, which she did completely anonymously, it could have been any random guy until Will so cleverly showed his face, again trying to make her into the bad guy.

    The only one being unprofessional and petty here is you, Will, you big fuckwad.

  21. “Just because a bad thing happened to a woman doesn’t make it misogyny.” Bingo!

    What this is, is a 3rd wave feminist trying to be relevant (and she’s not).

    Being that the preceding movements (1st and 2nd wave feminism) were loud and obnoxious, modern feminism has inherited this same legacy. And this is a perfect example; allow me to explain.

    It isn’t surprising at all that this woman would get upset over words and then shame someone for it. Well, that sucks. Maybe she should toughen up.

    And while the joke(s) probably sucked, Will had a good point. “Have you noticed that Barbara Holm never laughs at rape jokes, no matter how funny? She laughs at feminist jokes but no rape jokes. Come on, why don’t you laugh, Barbara?”

    It is my guess that Barbara Holm didn’t laugh at the rape joke(s) because it would disempower her and make her look weak. And we all know how much a feminist loves her power (trip), a masculine trait.

    I pray that the Portland comedy scene continues to challenge feminists for their passive aggressive crap. And that people like Barbara Holm continues to speak out against stupid jokes. Because it perfectly displays the modern feminist’s value; joke fodder.

    I have always thought that modern feminsts are the “nuns of our society”.

  22. “I usually try to resolve conflicts person to person like a grown up, ya know rather than taking it to a public forum…”

    You mean like you did onstage with a mic in your hand calling her out by name. Well, good job making yourself looking like even more of an ass in your response. And note, she didn’t mention you by name but thanks for letting us know who you are.

    Tiger Bauer, it is highly likely that she didn’t laugh because jokes at the expense of the victim are simply not funny. Now if the joke were at the expense of the rapist AND funny, she probably would laugh. I find it interesting that you defend rapists because we feminists are so evil though. Thanks for reminding us why some of us remain feminists.

  23. Leave will alone, im sick hearing how women are so mistreated. Apparently only about 7 people should have an opinion on this matter. The rest of you are just picking sides. Fuck barbara and all of you who are choosing to bury him. Viva la will.

  24. This escalated quickly.

    Comedians have every right to say whatever they want on stage, just as audience members have every right to not laugh and possibly feel offended/threatened by it. It seems silly to get mad at an audience member for not laughing at a joke; it’s impossible to appeal to everyone. It’s especially silly to call out a woman for not laughing at a joke involving rape. It just comes off sounding insensitive. Again, joke about whatever you want, but…Don’t expect everyone to enjoy it.

  25. Well, even though I’ve just now read the single most worrying commentary about feminism ever, thanks to WattaSurprise, all I came on here was to say was
    “Will, you enjoy offending people, that’s like your favorite part in comedy, but you fucked with the wrong G, son. Now that someone has spoken out, way more publically than you ever anticipated, you were given a chance to swallow some pride or shame or whatever it is that compels you, and you didn’t, and you made yourself un-anonymous in the process. Not your best move. Also, you never actually apologized when you had the chance to, instead you wrote on FB “I’m sorry if your feelers got hurt”, which is pretty much the biggest cop out you can pull in an apology, and finally, maybe this would be a good time to point out that berating an audience for not laughing makes everyone really uncomfortable and is nerve wracking to have to go up after you or anyone else when they do it”

    ok, that felt good.

  27. I’m always lost in hysterics when someone (e.g. Will) who crosses a line in public whines that the criticism was not done privately. If you have the nethers to talk shit in public, have the nethers to take — and discuss — the criticism in public. Whether or not one sees the incident in question as bullying, whining that criticism should be private (esp. given that their own, to begin with, wasn’t) is a pretty classic bully move.

  28. I don’t know if dudes realize how often women are told to do shit by rando creepers. It’s very annoying and makes me wear big ass headphones on trimet, every time every time. It’s something about women’s bodies being considered public domain, and dudes just wanting to hit on and impose their will upon any passing pair of bewbs.
    Its all a lark to the creeper, but it adds up on the woman. It makes her rightfully wary of public spaces. It makes her question her saftey. While most creepers do not escalate to outright threatening behavior, plenty do. How unfortunate that this phenomenon has been brought to the stage! It’s men pressing their luck/advantage, and oh shit, luck runs out. Yknowamsayn.

  29. “Just because a bad thing happened to a woman doesn’t make it misogyny.”

    True. But when a man is on a stage heckling a woman in the audience about rape and feminism, you know, it probably IS misogyny.

    The sad thing is, years later when this dude’s comedy career has gone nowhere, he’ll probably give his poor acquaintances long lectures about how it was all the fault of feminists and PC police, and not at all the fault of his arrogant, obtuse persona.

  30. “Just because a bad thing happened to a woman doesn’t make it misogyny.” First of all, it wasn’t just a “bad thing”. It wasn’t dropping your cup of coffee or tripping or something that fate or she brought upon herself. She’s not saying that whenever something bad happens it’s because she’s a woman or because of misogyny. But this guy did intentionally call her out, not comedically, in a society and culture that made him feel like he is entitled to do that and it won’t be seen as dickish. (You have the free speech to be a dick, but patriarchy means that he has it instilled that that is totally okay) It wouldn’t necessarily have been bullying or misogyny until he MADE IT A FREAKING SCREED OF MEN’S RIGHTS ACTIVISTS BY SAYING “She laughs at feminist jokes but not at rape jokes”. There’s a difference between a comedian doing crowd work and a dude on stage being petty and targeting an easy target, targeting her PERSONALLY!

    it’s like, a big dude with a microphone and all the attention in the room calling out a smaller woman by name in a show, aggressively, is not without sexist factors. Even relating his rape joke to her is unintentionally threatening, and i’d personally feel uncomfortable leaving that venue alone. Why? Because shit like that has statistically happened before and not had positive outcomes for women (like raaape) . Because of women being oppressed mostly by men in society, an undeniable fact. Because of misogyny.

    But hey, Barbara can write this blog if she wants because of FREE SPEECH! I didn’t know all these guys were against free speech and writing about rape jokes ;D

  33. Singling out an audience member for not laughing at a joke from onstage is a real boner move in comedy, regardless of the joke or gender politics at play.

  34. I was gonna post a really long rant about wills creating fake accounts to bash Barbra and commenting on the fake clickiness of the scene but lets me be real and ranting about why will migt not be sexist but he’s still an asshole but lets be real that’s all a waste of time. and no body listens to anything i say anyway

    so instead i’ll just say

    will your still pissed that helium makes you purchase two items when you sign up for the open mic, and Barbara gets regular work at heium. your comments have over 100 thumbs down and Marcus Gibson isnt the biggest asshole in the room right now.

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  36. I was gonna post a really long rant about wills creating fake accounts to bash Barbra and commenting on the fake clickiness of the scene but lets me be real and ranting about why will migt not be sexist but he’s still an asshole but lets be real that’s all a waste of time. and no body listens to anything i say anyway

    so instead i’ll just say

    will your still pissed that helium makes you purchase two items when you sign up for the open mic, and Barbara gets regular work at heium. your comments have over 100 thumbs down and Marcus Gibson isnt the biggest asshole in the room right now.

  38. Will, you ever consider maybe your joke sucked and that it’s not anyone’s responsibility to laugh at it?

    Would you have called out a black man deciding not to laugh at a joke about slavery? Because if your answer is no, then you are definitely a misogynist.

    Did you ever stop to think that as a comedy n00b you should tread lightly? When did you think it was a good idea to start telling rape jokes before you even established trust within the comedy community (or y’know, at all)?

    I consider it an act of authenticity to withhold laughter when something isn’t funny, and it gives you a better gauge as to how well you performed. If someone wasn’t laughing at my jokes, I wouldn’t lash out at them, I would take a moment to reconsider the quality of my comedy and work harder next time.

  39. I can’t state this enough, I said nothing about the victim(as the line doesn’t even have a victim), that was made up and like most of the things people have said about me, are misinformed. Also, I didn’t come here to change minds, I came here because I was being talked about and I need to get my side in for myself everyone’s reaction I can’t control.

    Also just so there isn’t some weird belief, I do what I do, for the posts with 40 dislikes, not for the people who think I’m fucked up or whatever, and don’t understand. I would rather say my part and be hated for it, than be silent, its just how I live.

    Oh and dear Andie, I want you to understand this, im not sorry for what happened, and I’m not hiding, cowardice is for weak people, I don’t expect many people to agree with me here, (and those that do, it means a lot to me)but I want to be seen for what I am, rather than am not, even if you think me a fool. I would take it to a stage, but apparently that’s a no-no

    no matter how you see this I hope you can all agree that Marcus Gibson is an idiot.

  42. “no matter how you see this I hope you can all agree that Marcus Gibson is an idiot.”

    So now it’s okay for you to bash people in public? You’re a sexist and a hypocrite!

  43. etsie, I’m a touring headline and middle guy who has been doing comedy for just shy of a decade, my jokes I was trying were getting all 7 of my audience, even Barbra. Oh and Marcus Gibson is an idiot, and I never said it wasn’t ok to bash people in public, you should try reading in the future.

  44. so speakeath the coward without a real name and the man digging himself a deeper a whole. Im out i graduated highschool in 2005. Im gonna go talk to adults

  48. esty aka jhon washington. One time after getting an entire basement barcade to sing Boethius rhapsody Belinda Carroll drunkenly put her arm around my shoulder and said i think its really cool that your such a militant feminist. Some craiglist ad that was read and interprated by a bunch of rejects has me labled as a sexist. No i spent a year volunteering at the womans resouce center fin the men in the movment program talking to freshman about the danger of rape culture and gender voilnce .I saved one drunk friend from being moved to second location, and another from their man learing near her unattended drink ive seen homless men hit homless woman in the park blocks and followed them untill the girl was alone and sliped her a buisness card for the womans crisiss line. I carry a ream of them in my wallet. I have been supportive to five friends in abusive relationships taking a tolll on my own emotional psyche because everyone else they knew just couldn’t deal with it, and i knew there were could a time that they would need help escaping and I helped two of them escape. The other 3 get my phone calls intercepted when men make micro aggression that seem to genuinely come from a place of mysgony i correct them and tell them its not cool with the same aggresive attitude i’m giveing you for your misunderformed slam on me. I know the phone numbers for the woman crisis line, and 2 woman shelters by memory.I’ve conviced relative out of state to board my friends escapeing relationship Don’t fucking call me sexist. I may saything or have ideas for podcast that people dont like cause there idiots, but i do not participate in the active oppression of woman, and in fact have devoted huge part of the last three years of my life to the opposite that. So go fuck your self etsy/jonh washington. You can call easy scape goat a sexist and act like you’ve done your part , but i guarentee you i’ve helped more woman than suscribers to your podcast

    and the definition of hypocrisey is calling someone an idiot and then chastising them for “basing” people in public

  50. Umm, Marcus Gibson, perhaps you should re-read my comment…I was standing up for you. The quote was from Will, I was calling him a sexist.

  53. “..want to be seen for what I am…”

    We’re in a comedy renaissance, no doubt. There are so many amazing comics-men and women-getting their due as the field grows and grows. Amen. Too many amazing people to name. Delaney, Oswalt, Bamford, Peretti. Local, national. I could name 50 more of both genders. I think Barbara is quite funny and smart. She leaves a very positive mark on the landscape.

    Hate to say it b/c I don’t want to be mean but here’s how you appear to anyone not of your ilk or a youtube commentor: the worst of what this field shits out on the back end of all that greatness.

    I wish you were more new to the field, Will, because then I could hope for you to grow. I was shocked to read you have that much experience because what kind of comic uses his precious 5-10 minutes on stage to call out another comic by name for ANYTHING let alone not laughing at rape jokes? That’s bordeline sociopathic. Then to think her follow-up column about the incident “furthers the problem” as you say, as if opening her mouth about it, and leaving you anonymous still, was in some way flawed and unjustified? Don’t dumb pro-rape joke dudebros always lean on and champion freedom of speech in regard to such issues? Shouldn’t that be applied evenly across all forums, in your eyes? Can’t for the life of me see why not other than to again see the part above about sociopathy. Let me finish by adding laughably entitled and totally unfunny to that list, too.

  54. Honestly though, Will doesn’t seem like a bad person. I just watched one of his sets…and I’m a rabid feminist…and it doesn’t seem like he’s a chauvinist. Gender aside, I do think he’s a dick for implying I didn’t read his posts. Perhaps he’s a dick in general, but it seems more like he’s just fumbling, defensive, insecure, and kind of ignorant.

    I do think this could’ve been handled in a way that didn’t result in divisiveness, and I mean that coming from both sides. I think Will could’ve sucked it up and not lashed out because she didn’t laugh at his joke, and Barbara could’ve spoken to him after the show and said, “hey, you may have noticed I didn’t laugh at your joke…that’s because it was offensive. You may want to reconsider material about sexual assault” to which Will could’ve replied, “I’m sorry, you’re right, I’m a man and sometimes I fail to acknowledge that I’m on the privileged side of the rape joke argument, I’ll be more sensitive in the future.”

    This whole thing is kind of childish.

  55. Savage Ashley lol even if I did e mailed all my info to you, we both know it wouldn’t satisfy you, that’s not how the game works.

  56. sigh. this is hard, as i know and respect and genuinely _like_ the both of you, as colleagues, funny-makers and… friends? i hope? i’m not at every mic or showcase yet and i know both of you don’t know me all that well. colleague-acquaintance-friend, maybe?

    in any case, i chatted with our mutual pal jt about this today, as when i saw barb’s tweet earlier this week, i became neurotically paranoid that it was something _i_ had said after my set that had made her feel that way. i was relieve it wasn’t, but if it had been, i would have just immediately apologized and said i won’t ever do it again and i hope it will not hurt our colleague-acquaintance-friend-ish-ship(?). because i do respect and like your comedy. a lot, a lot, a lot. i was quoting & crediting you today to a friend when their cat got hair all over my black slacks. you know the one. 😉

    and to will – i do appreciate that you put yourself out there, take chances, push the edge, say what’s on your mind and try and mine comedy from some very intimate and freaky stuff from your own life. i respect that and have been there when you made this work successfully. i had left said venue by the time this happened, so i’m only getting this second hand from what barb wrote, your comments in response, and my chat with jt. first off, dude, as i had to learn then unfortunate hard way earlier in my life, even more unfortuneately, at a later age than you are now, the determination of if someone feels offended or victimized or bullied is never from the one doing the bullying who then self-justifies what they do; it is _always_ determined by those who feel victimized. end of story. you might feel that unfair, or you should get to tell your side, and go, “but wait, but wait, but WAIT! you don’t understand! i mean…” whatever. the more you go on like that, the more you dig your own insensitive asshat hole. it’s best, always, just to say, “you’re right, you were hurt, i am sorry.” you can ask for clarification to understand what you did that hurt them, but never to self-justify, just so you know, don’t do that shit again.

    and while i appreciate your, will’s, ability to push the edge, there’s a difference between edge-pushing and mining comedy wisdom from your own experiences, and just rattling off events in your experience and seeing which stick. i think, sometimes, maybe, just as a suggestion, a wee bit of self-editing might be a good thing before hitting the stage. i, personally, tend to err on the side of speaking truth to power, not singling out the obviously unempowered. and most comics, with low-paying day jobs just trying to get to the next showcase and pray they’ll never need healthcare until they can afford it would be always in the latter category. not everything will work and the last thing i do, personally, is blame an audience, particularly one member, however well i think i know them, for not laughing. i know it’s now become a standard bit of crowd work to go, “i thought that would be funnier,” or, “really? you guys gonna go all silent on that one?” but i tend to avoid those. it can work if it is self-deprecating, but if it is you turning on the audience, it can easily turn back on you, this dialogue being a case in point. the audience has already given me their verdict, i need go no further than that response or lack thereof. jokes are like food, it tastes great or it’s dog poop on a cracker. it’s my responsibility to take the immediate feedback, and that is re-work my delivery, re-write the joke, or toss it. and certainly not single anyone out, unless they are being a heckling asshat. barb is never like that, from what i’ve experienced.

    again, i respect you both, and am sorry to see the dialogue descend to this. now i’ll go curl up in a ball in a corner and rock myself, whimpering, “why can’t mom and dad stop fighting?!”

    except for one last thing: JRRTrollkien, WattaSurprise & barbasher1 are asshats of the first degree. like they go around wearing those liners for the toilet seat as cowboy hats on their heads, all the time. they can go have their own lemon party together, as that is all, pretty much, they are fit for. ’nuff sed.

  57. TSW: as awesome as you seem, it’s not funny to joke about people being sociopaths. A sociopath attempted to murder me this summer. Throwing that word around dilutes the meaning, and despite this guy being super maladroit, let’s not completely destroy his life by labeling him a sociopath. He seems like a big lug from Beaverton, probably with little more than a high school education, so it’s a little extreme to lynch him. We weren’t there, we didn’t hear the joke, so let’s not jump to conclusions. Also, Will, right now might be a good time for you to swallow your pride if you want to retain any dignity.

  59. it shouldn’t be shocking what the fuck am I supposed to do send you my tax info? there is no winning in what you asked of me, which I assume is why you said it.

  62. I’d also like to point out that saying “Have you noticed that Barbara Holm never laughs at rape jokes, no matter how funny? She laughs at feminist jokes but no rape jokes. Come on, why don’t you laugh, Barbara?” is the equivalent of “why don’t you smile? You look so much prettier when you smile” a.k.a dictating what women should do with their bodies and implying they need to be pleasant and placating all the time.

  63. othere is nothing sexit about trying to get a woman to smile. Thats riddiculous you seriously suggesting that when a man tries to seduce a smile out of a woman he is being sexist. Like what the hell. Woman try to make men smile, and men men and woman woman, and wanting someone to smile has nothing to do with the being arousedeven though a smile is more appealing aesthetically then it frown its about being human and having empathy and feeling bad when someone is sad and you know there sad when they frown and you know there happy when they smile and you want every one you care about to be happy weather you want your dick in them or not. This is a discconnect that some femist pholsphy do not consider when alleging sexism the patrichy would have men and woman belive that men are emtionless sex hungry monkeys, not everything a man does is motivated by wanting to controll a womans body, maybe he just want her to be happy, which is a selfless and honorbale desire

    Seriously

  64. Dude, I am not talking about sweet men complimenting a girl’s smile or doing something to make her smile, you misunderstand me. I am talking about walking down the street every.single.fucking.day and having strange men tell you to smile. Usually if you don’t smile (because maybe you’re having a bad day and it’s okay not to smile because you’re an autonomous human being) they will call you a bitch or a whore or a cunt. It’s about control, not friendliness.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/09/06/s…

  65. The best thing about Duct Tape is it turns “No,No,No” into “Mm,Mm,Mm”.

    Is that a rape joke technically?
    It could be a kidnap or murder joke. Hard to say.

  67. ps Jon, the line was a tag that follows a joke
    “in the industry we call that joke rape, and im gonna look you in the fucking eyes while im doing it”

    PPS I like how you acted like you didn’t know me

  69. Not only would I not laugh at a comedian that was telling rape jokes, but…that’s a thing? Rape jokes. I love my comedy, but I find no humor in that. I am pretty disgusted to think ANYONE does.

    And call you out in public. Will, are you fucking idiot or a fucking piece of shit with no clue? You weren’t called out until you piped in. Plus, your excuse is a lame one. “The room was weird, so I lashed out at the one person not laughing at a rape jokes. You should see what I did to the person who didn’t laugh at my incest humor.”

  70. I, for one, will never again be using the nefarious “Canola Oil” for any of my food cooking, pan greasing, or sexual lubrication activities (not even naked Twister).

    I have just become aware that this seemingly innocuous oil is in fact the edible oil of the rapeseed, of the evil rape plant, masquerading in disguise as a healthy vegan friendly fat. I will not be consuming the greasy by-products of any plant with deviant tendencies toward sexual violence or connotations related to such. Good day to you, sir.

  71. I really don’t mind if you’re a headliner. At Harvey’s. At the casinos. At showcases. Whatever. I’ve seen you before, and I don’t recall you being especially funny, but that was years ago. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt that you got better.

    I’ve also been privy to enough open mics to my misfortune of dating a comic (24 Energy Drink, pls) to know that my laughter, boisterous as it is, is a privilege. I’m sorry you think it’s a right as a co-worker/fellow comedian/someone witnessing your hilarity.

    I get that most dudes don’t understand misogyny. Think of life as a video game: as a straight white dude, you get to play on easy. A person of color, a woman, a homosexual, a disabled person… we have to play on a higher level. We can still win, but it’s fucking harder. Comedy is supposed to make people feel better, not worse.

  72. Sometimes a rape joke is funny, but it usually comes from someone who had themselves been raped, or someone who belongs to the demographic wherein the majority has experienced sexual assault…like a woman.

    A rape joke is like the N-word, don’t say it unless YOUR PEOPLE are the ones on whom the
    oppression that it symbolizes are piled.

  73. http://www.laughspin.com/2011/09/07/when-does-heckling-a-comedian-become-sexual-harassment/

    I got bullied and attacked on the Portland Board… um its freedom of speech. THIS IS THE ENTERTAINMENT BUSINESS. Will is a sweet guy…. It just sets female comics back to the stone age …. get over it. Move on… shit I have had worse shit said about me on a Portland Board that I couldn’t even respond too… GO WRITE SOME JOKES …. you guys have now become the bullies that you are bitching about…. MOVE ON…. book some gigs~ put your energy into something positive. I saw Will naked once, lets talk about that. (see, that was at least funny!)
    Will, can you book me for some gigs now?

  74. “Have you noticed that Barbara Holm never laughs at rape jokes, no matter how funny?”

    So the joke is “I suspect that THIS woman (the one right here in this room that I’m pointing out) is a rape victim, everyone look at this rape victim”, right?

    I wouldn’t open with it.

  75. Robert your formula needs work.

    Jon I’m not afraid of getting beat up by women, so its different than the n word

    To the “I won’t see you” people… It’s sad you will miss a great show! luckily for me I have enough fans to get by at the moment, besides I don’t talk about the evils of “sportsball” or knittig in my act, so I hope you see you see something more fitting to your taste… Oh the wonders of choice.

    Oh Susan I am looking at a new room that Travis kenny didn’t get shut down, lemme know if you haz any avails in december.

  77. It’s a comedian’s JOB to make people laugh. If no one laughs, YOU are doing your job wrong. This is no one’s fault but the person with the mic.

  78. “She laughs at feminist jokes but she doesn’t laugh at rape jokes.” ? Was that meant to make you feel like a comedy bigot? Stand-up comedy is the greatest art form. It’s just too bad that we’ll let anybody do it. I have rape jokes, but I attack the guilty.

  85. So, subject matter and sexual politics/male privilege aside, what kind of dum-dum/big baby performer interrupts his own performance to ask a specific audience member (by name no less) why they are not enjoying his performance as much as he wants? That’s gonna immediately alienate your audience because 1) “oh my god is he going to turn to me next” 2) “oh shit is this guy gonna lose it on stage right now”. And being anything but gracious to your audience – and this scenario explicitly – is really fucking entitled. It gives the impression that this is a guy who drives in the transit lanes of the bus mall because why should buses have their own lanes, or that he ignores the line at a bar and just finds an open place and starts shouting for a drink because why should I have to wait in line.

    Bonus ad hominem attack: probably jean shorts.

  87. So Will is officially the creepy old dude at bus stops insisting that women “put a smile on that beautiful face.”

    Got it. 2/10, will not see perform comedy.

  88. I just watched an old George Carlin special. Not only did he use the N-word with a hard R, he also cast aspersions on the physical appearance of your average feminist.

    My point? I hate you all. Ice Prez for MVP.

  90. I’m so glad to see Blogtown running at its finest. We saw our favorite trolls demonstrating how desperate they are for any attention at all, and some new faces, too! Ones that presumably have not read the expiration date on their material and don’t particularly care for a career in comedy post-1990!

    Come on, bring it in guys. Big hug. I love you all. I’m just so emotional. You know, like a woman.

    And what’s up with airplane food.

    Asian drivers.

  91. Wait, I had to come back here after noticing something else.

    EtsySeller (whom Will seems to think is a “Jon” using a pseudonym), said: “A rape joke is like the N-word, don’t say it unless YOUR PEOPLE are the ones on whom the oppression that it symbolizes are piled.”

    Will’s response? “Jon I’m not afraid of getting beat up by women, so its different than the n word”

    Dude, if your only metric for deciding “Should I perform this potentially offensive joke?” is “Will the offended party be able to beat me up?,” you really need to rethink comedy.

  92. EVERYBODY HERE HAS TO BE THE SAME! IF YOU DO NOT HAVE SIX TATTOOS SKINNY JEANS AND A MOUSTACHE NOBODY WANTS TO TALK TO YOU! AND THAT INCLUDES THE LADIES!

    IF YOU DON’T AGREE WITH EVERYTHING THE MAJORITY SAYS YOU WILL BE OUTCAST TO SALEM!

  93. It is really a sad thing that someone who has experienced a traumatic event such as rape is sometimes reminded of it in uncomfortable settings. Lots of people have been raped. Lots of people have had traumatic experiences other than rape too. It can be hard for someone to say, “my pain hurts more than your pain,” or to suggest that a person’s own traumatic past takes a priority over someone else’s. In fact that’s the sort of mentality that perpetuates pain, rather than alleviates it. So in the name of equality, the Portland comedians should make a collective list of all their traumatic life events. Parent beat them up. Alcoholic ex-spouse. Abandoned as a child. Lost a child. Had a child. Veteran with PTSD. Made fun of for being gay. Made fun of for being straight. The list should not include suggestions from non-comedians though. Comedians only. Because comedians know more about what is funny than normal people who enjoy paying to sit in a room watching and laughing at jokes. And not all comedians should get to contribute to the list; only the comedians whose ethos most closely resembles the common view of all that is “Portland,” for while all comedians are equal, some are more equal than others. Then they should set the list on fire, and focus instead on writing better material, getting better stage chops, and growing their own following instead of trying to diminish someone else’s.

  94. When the Daniel Tosh controversy happened, I read a lot of comedians’ opinions on the subject of rape in comedy, and it was pretty interesting. The most common one was along the lines of “I don’t think anything should be inherently off the table in comedy, but there are subjects that I personally avoid because the risk v. reward isn’t worth it”.

    There are comedians that cut like a knife that can use rape, or racism, or child abuse, or any topic in a clever enough way that it’s legitimately funny enough to be worth it. But there are a lot more that will use them as a cheap punchline for shock value. Barbara echoes this sentiment with “Second, it’s not simply that I hate rape jokes. I hate rape jokes that are directed at the victim. They are mean spirited, and often dumb.”

    If you’re going to do a joke with rape, it’d better be a really fucking funny joke. And don’t be a dick to someone for not laughing.

  95. Oh Will, you keep digging yourself deeper and deeper into this hole. Maybe rather than worrying about all the commenters, you should be focusing on writing better material? That way you won’t have to berate your audience members in order to get a laugh.
    Also, no-one knew who you were until you identified yourself in the comments. Idiot.
    And finally, you have revealed yourself to be not only sexist but also racist with this gem of a comment “I’m not afraid of getting beat up by women, so its different than the n word.”
    Just keep digging, my friend.

  96. Yeah Will. Keep digging. Eventually you might have a deep enough pit that you will have an open face gold mine and you can dissolve away all that useless sediment with sodium cyanide to get at that sweet sweet golden ore.

  97. “If you’re going to do a joke with rape, it’d better be a really fucking funny joke” is only half correct. If you’re going to do any joke, if you’re going to take up an audience’s time, if you’re going to commandeer someone else’s business in order to try and advance your own, it’d better be a really fucking funny joke.

  98. Wait, Will. Are you saying that the only reason you don’t use the N-word is because you think black people will beat you up? Not because it’s a shitty thing to do? Also, it says something that you assume black people will immediately resolve things with violence.

  99. 100% support here, Barbara.

    And all the rape joke defenders, if you believe it is impossible to do a joke that is not offensive, you are probably a bigot not a comedian.

  101. If I understand ‘Will” correctly, by being at a comedy club, everyone has to laugh at everything he says, or else they are, hmm, what? Not amused? If you’re not funny, people don’t laugh. If a fellow comedian doesn’t laugh at everything you say, get over it. She did not identify him in her post, but now the entire audience of the Mercury, and beyond, knows you are a clueless, arrogant prick who’s an asshole on stage to fellow comedians in the audience who don’t laugh at everything he says.

    You, sir, are pathetic little butt-hurt douche bag. Maybe lame jokes are the reason your ‘headlining’ ass is playing to 7 people at an open mic. Dipshit.

  102. Sorry, ballarddude. Headliners still do open mics. Barbara Holm was at said mic. Should we talk about the lame quotient of her jokes as well? Just trying to follow your logic. Is this an indictment on everyone who does open mics, or just the people who you want to inflict bad reasoning on for an excuse to call someone you don’t agree with a “dipshit”?

  103. People keep bludgeoning crowds with rape jokes and then acting surprised when the cudgel is ripped from their hands and they’re bludgeoned back.

    I used cudgel and bludgeon in a sentence, y’ouns.

  104. So much shit reasoning in this thread. Alright: it honestly sounds like Will was failing to make with the funny, and made the stupid choice to call out someone he knew while he was flailing, in an unfunny way.

    Lest you think this is some specific niche issue for me, Will: I made the same observation when W. Kamau Bell was complaining about Portland audiences failing to laugh at being called racists: it sounds like you weren’t funny. You weren’t funny, and you’re demonstrating how fucking tone deaf you are with everything you’re subsequently posting here.

  105. Will’s just showing everyone that the fastest way to make a grown ass man turn into a little child is for a woman not to laugh at his jokes.

  106. For what it’s worth three or four years ago Barbra was hosting laff hole in Seattle and when she introduced me the first thing I said is Give it up for your host Barbra isn’t she rapeable folks? It was just the first thing that came out my mouth, I didn’t plan on saying it but I did. It was a joke. I guess I said it bc Barbra is a small girl, and I Look like a piece of shit. Barbra never batted an eye and did a great job hosting the rest of the night. When I got off stage I went directly up to Barbra and apologized if I had offended her and she was surprised to know I had even said that, she thought I said Give it up for your host Barbra isn’t she CAPABLE. When I told her what I had really said we just laughed about the word capable. The next week I got an email from some dumb bitch in the crowd who was so offended by what I had said that she wrote me a three page email, explaining how humiliated Barbra must have been. Well I explained to her I did apologize to Barbra but she didn’t care. You know why she didn’t care? Bc she’s a fucking comedian. Either way no comic should care if another comic isn’t laughing at their jokes. Oh and shut up Marcus!

  107. Sorry for not commenting before now, I’ve been too busy trying to figure out what you get when you cross a blank with a blank.

  108. What a nasty piece of work. I’m so bored with people trying to defend rape jokes.
    We comics are an insecure bunch. Often, the goofy socially awkward type…finally coming into our own behind the mic. This incident highlights how thin the line is that separates us from being the bullied ones to becoming the bullies ourselves.
    In that moment he wasn’t ‘punching up’ anymore…he was punching down. And all around. At you.
    I absolutely hate it when comics chastise the audience for not laughing. If you’re confident that your material is great and then it fails? At least own it. Enjoy the silence.

  109. In terms of rape jokes, this one was fairly light. But still, I think rape is a word and topic that should be avoided when you’re tying to make people enjoy themselves. In my desperately sought-after opinion, Will screwed up, but he’s still a good comic otherwise. It’s unfair for people to judge a comedian based on two sentences at the tail end of an open mic. That being said, mentioning rape on stage is the quickest way to alienate audiences and comics alike, and rightfully so.

    Every comic has been bullied. It’s why we’re comics instead of emotionally-stable human beings. This might be the most unpopular comment of the thread, but I support Barbara’s anger, and I also support Will as a talented comedian except for this instance. Everyone who’s posted in this is funnier than I am, but I just hope both sides can forgive each other and embrace harmony over discord.

  110. Will Woodruff wasn’t a deluded comic thinking he’s entitled to the audience attention.

    This was a man attacking a woman in public because she writes a column about misogyny.

    She was doing nothing wrong and had never done anything to him.

    Yet he targeted her from a stage and tried to intimidate and shame her by yelling at her about rape in front of an audience.

    Will Woodruff used a comedy mic to sexually harass a woman because she criticizes rape culture.

    She had never talked about him before, and did not name even after the attack.

    He took credit for the attack because he feels men should have the right to attack women in the audience for having opinions they don’t like. He, and his defenders, are angry men who harass women, and should be prevented from doing so.

    This is going national; I’m from another city. I will make sure Will is banned from stages here, because he’s not a comic, he’s an angry misogynist who hijacks the mic for his hateful agenda.

  111. And Will, do not play the victim. She didn’t name you or the location. No one except a tiny number of insiders would have known the details, and most would not have cared. If someone else had identified you, sure then be upset at them, but no one did. You and your rep was safe, but because you are an entitled dude you felt the need to identify yourself and attack her a second time. And both times, it’s because you don’t like women who criticize rape culture. And it’s clear you take it personally and felt like that was an excuse to give her a hard time, even though she doesn’t give you a hard time. Bullying victims isn’t new or original or edgy, it’s the default position of society and if you are going to make jokes where you, the man holding the mic, is attacking a woman about rape jokes, it had better be the best planned amazing moment in the world and even then, you are a guy attacking rape victims about not laughing about jokes at their expense. And the only reason you feel the need to take your stuff public on this, dude, is because deep down, you have an agenda and it’s one that hates women. So please, all his defenders stop pretending this isn’t what it’s about. Dudes who don’t like women get angry and yell at them when they don’t behave as they should. Stop pretending it’s about the comedy biz, it’s about whether someone with problems continues to indulge them.

  112. Glad you got called out. Rape is not funny. If you are not a good comic then just work on that instead of trying to dismiss the woman in the room, whom I will guess is a better comic than you are. So work on your stuff, don’t dismiss the person in the room who you might learn something from.

  113. couple things before I put this to rest

    1. All things can be funny, if my joke(s) about rape didn’t get good laughs repeatedly I would stop using them…and I understand you dislike for a joke about rape, I have no argument to say it’s in good taste, but again I have to decide what I do and don’t do, sorry if you think that job was left to the angry mob.

    2. the not afraid of getting beat up by a woman line is a classic joke, I had to throw it in! I don’t drop too many slurs out of respect, even though I am a big “but they said it!” kind of person but I have used them, and will probably happen again, hopefully my friends know there is no hate behind it, and that I am capable of fucking up… See Stanhope’s act for further details.

    3. Just so everyone knows, in retrospect I am not sorry about the joke(its mine), and keep in mind other comics went at me from with the god mic from off stage, and I just lashed out, and in this case I did hit a bystander, which by the way isn’t bullying, and as former 3 time captain(and first board) of Sprague High School’s chess team, and the guy that always wore sweatpants, I can tell you what happened was not bullying, I do know the difference. It was however more akin to someone not involved getting shot in a drive by, and she shot back. But when people are yelling shit at you and attacking, you don’t say sorry to that… or at least I don’t.

    Lastly this isn’t me saying I was wronged I pretty much never think that, I’m a big boy I can handle myself, even if another comic throws a shoe at me or verbally rips me a new ass, or whatever… so be it, what I am saying is that I agree with Richard Bain, Marcus Gibson is an idiot.(not exact quote)

    PS feel free to call up and tell me how bad of a person I am next week on stand-up sitdown(I can plug too)

    PPS hooker with a penis, I liked your take on this, what are your rates?

  115. This column and entire comment thread has been a wonderful learning experience for a 3 month old comedy-baby like myself.

    Moral of all this: words and actions matter! Be nice, friends!

  116. Will, what you did was fucked up, grow a pair of balls and apologize, and go the fuck away, rape jokes aren’t funny, period. Also, what you perceive being funny to the people around you and what is actually funny are two entirely different things. It would help you be less of a shithead if you learned that, and I most certainly speak from experience.

  117. Will Woodruff, you admit you attacked someone who wasn’t attacking you: “keep in mind other comics went at me from with the god mic from off stage, and I just lashed out, and in this case I did hit a bystander”. Attacking someone who did nothing to you and is unable to fight back at that moment seems like bullying to me.

    Someone allegedly got on your case via the PA (perhaps one of the organizers). It wasn’t Barbara Holm and you knew it. You admit she wasn’t doing anything to you, but you attacked her by name. In your first comment, you admit your attack was motivated by an agenda: “I was calling you on something… something that annoys more people than just myself,” and by “something” you mean she dared to criticized rape jokes in general before.

    Rather than respond to the people who you claim were actually giving you a hard time, you singled out a woman who hasn’t singled you out just because you find her criticism of rape culture annoying. As if it was her fault or responsibility for your failure to be funny.

    Worst of all, when she writes about this in the abstract, keeping your identity secret. You get enraged and identify yourself and continue to act like it’s somehow not your fault you attacked someone who did nothing to you.

    Just own up to targeting a woman because that’s how you roll when you bomb. Admit you’ve got a grudge against Holm, apparently because she’s a feminist and thus obligated to laugh at rape jokes no matter what or some resentful comedy bro crap.

    Also, if you are going to be an edgy, confrontational artist – using the utterly cliché, boring tactic of being shocking by being a white guy talking about rape – you don’t get to demand that the audience support every joke.

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